Curse

sinican · Aug 24, 2006, 10:17 PM // 22:17

ok i got tired of reading the flames...

now here is mine

trully it is a bad idea to expand the number of skill slots in its entirety... keep it short the reason their are only 8 is because of balance... limiting a player to 8 skills of the 100's per class is what creates diversity and keep any single class from being overpowered (yea this is debatable in the spirit of all those who hate gimp builds)

HOWEVER... i like a lited version of the idea...

aka have a dedicated res skill slot (res sig only perhaps) i dont believe this would cause much havock when it comes to any pvp nor is it something i feel threatens pve... there are a lot of classes such as the assassin that surely could use a spot dedicated for res ... there are a few other classes i feel arent quite complete do to the limit of 8 skills minus 1 for res...

and possibly a dedicated spot for perhaps elite skills....

so this would allow still only 1 elite but also no more sacrificing utility for a res... and in full effect allow trully 8 skills between the chosen professions
AND lol we only have 10 number key buttons

AND I know that to some even adding dedicated non skill slots for an elite and res sig still sounds like an imbalance issue...but please remember they alter skills all the time to balance and simlar could be done to not allow these dedicated slot to have any inherent/underlying effects for the actual 8 skill limit... also everyone would have the same slots with the same change in skill theory INCLUDING the AI

it is possible... and it also may be something that does happen to expand guildwars gameplay in the future.... sometimes when game eventually gets dull, such a little change brings back a big enough spark to make the same game completely different and fun all over again.

Stockholm · Aug 24, 2006, 10:37 PM // 22:37

/notsigned

8 skill slots are part of the basic balance in gw

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lets Get to Healing

What is this? The 1 millionth thread with this topic?

well search is not running at 100% yet and OP is kind of new here(Join Date: Jun 2006)

penguo · Aug 24, 2006, 10:41 PM // 22:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by Curse You

I guess you've never been to The Deep, Fissure of Woe or Underworld, probably because you use an assassin (they never work in those areas). There are enemies that use 2 elite skills wandering around those areas.

Also, to the OP, if you want more than 8 skill slots, go play WoW or something like that.

Yeah....8 is what makes guildwars unique IMO. In WoW you can setup your UI so that you can acess every one of your skills at the same time, and change at any time.

ryanryanryan0310 · Aug 24, 2006, 10:45 PM // 22:45

/not signed

huMptY DumPty · Aug 25, 2006, 12:02 AM // 00:02

/notsigned

I don't feel the need to have a 9th or save 10th skill slot.

The lack of room limits one's capabilities at times, but, it makes this game very demanding in terms of one's build.

Ian Savage · Aug 25, 2006, 12:19 AM // 00:19

Here's the deal. With MMO's, you can go one of 2 ways. Skill based. OR! More Time Put Into Farming and Buying Stuff Off Ebay to Pimperize Yo Character Based. Anet made the RIGHT choice and went with Skill based. If you increase the number of available skill slots, It takes out a good 50-75% of the skill involved. If you dont like being forced to use your brain when playing an MMO, fine. Go play WoW and leave us all alone. No way in the ninteenbillionOMGIMFREAKINGONFIRE Hellz will this ever be a reasonable idea. and btw, what we are placing here are our opinions.

/notsignedforever

tuperwho · Aug 25, 2006, 12:27 AM // 00:27

There have been multiple occasions where I've been working on builds and struggling between adding that 8th skill I want or a res, where I've thought about this topic. I even had it justified at one point that it wouldn't bee too much freedom in the fact that your skill choice would still be limited by attributes and attribut points. However, I always realize that these are just temporary periods of me being upset that I can't make the decision to cut a skill myself. It's true what everyone is saying that it's a fundamental game mechanic. The game is great and really fun as is, and I personally do not want to take the risk to see what kind of changes something like this could bring.

So, long story short, I have to give it a respectful
/not signed

Relambrien · Aug 25, 2006, 12:33 AM // 00:33

/notsigned for the original idea

The game runs perfectly fine with just eight skills. Also, the game was designed so that it is dependent upon each player's personal skill, not a specific skill or level they have. That was the reason for the level 20 cap, and the reason for the 8 skill cap. A person needs to be able to fit all facets of a character (attack, defense, utility, resurrection) within eight skills to have a character most would find "acceptable." This challenges the players, and thereby increases their personal skill. Remember the 55 soloers for UW? Anet made it tougher, with the Dying Nightmares and the Prot Bond nerf, and players got better because of it. So when Anet makes something hard/harder, it ends up making the players better. And who doesn't want to get better?

However, the following idea intrigued me, as I had had the same one a little while ago.

Quote:

Originally Posted by sinican

aka have a dedicated res skill slot (res sig only perhaps) i dont believe this would cause much havock when it comes to any pvp nor is it something i feel threatens pve... there are a lot of classes such as the assassin that surely could use a spot dedicated for res ... there are a few other classes i feel arent quite complete do to the limit of 8 skills minus 1 for res...

While this would in effect give another skill to everyone, it would also ensure that everyone on your team has a resurrection skill, which can be invaluable in both PvP and PvE. A nice idea, but it won't happen. Even one more skill slot would totally throw off the game as new FotM are created, and new PvE farming builds are formed. Though I'm all for new builds, I think it would be too advantageous to have another skill, and bad things would happen.

hadech · Aug 25, 2006, 01:27 AM // 01:27

Definately /notsigned

Undivine · Aug 25, 2006, 09:37 AM // 09:37

To be honest, I would love it if they added one more skill slot. Who's to say they won't? Adding another skill slot is 1 more bullet on the back of a Guild Wars expansion (even though they would impliment it for everyone, whether they got the new chapter or not).

Although my ranger (usually), nor my monk don't need the extra slot... my mesmer and my ritualist always seem to be short. For the record I almost never bring a res signet. Only 2 of my characters have a permenant res and I bring those, but never a res signet. You may say that's irresponsible, but in the 13 or 14 months I've played this game I have only needed it, I think, twice.

And would 1 more slot really break the game? Hardly. The monsters only use about 3-5 skills usually, so they don't really matter. If you think of all the FOTM builds, they only really relied on a handful of skills, sometimes even just 2 skills. I don't see how an extra slot would be overpowered when the overpowered builds don't even come close to using all 8 slots. It's the skills that are overpowered, not the number of skills.

I'll tell you what an extra slot adds; diversity. I love to experiment with new builds people haven't tried yet. Having an extra slot only increases the size of my canvas. A 9th skill slot would definately make me play more Guild Wars. If it means my mesmer would actually be able to do something besides wand against an all-melee group when he went all anti-caster then I support it.

But an extra 6 slots or so.... nah. That's unneccessary.

vaxmor · Aug 26, 2006, 03:21 AM // 03:21

its fine - learn 2 play.

GW is not WoW-lite.

GW is not for you.

aB- · Aug 26, 2006, 03:37 AM // 03:37

I am against any change in the number of skill slots. If it is increased to 9, then when will it stop? People will complain for 10 because it's "only one more." And eventually we're sitting at 15 slots wondering what happened.

The truth itself · Aug 26, 2006, 12:54 PM // 12:54

Omfg.. A thought stroke me, imagine rerolling with more skills?

No way!

Mushroom · Aug 26, 2006, 02:40 PM // 14:40

How about a form of compromise between 8, and more then 8.

Simply give 2 more skills. This would work easily, since there are 10 number keys. And have the last two disabled during combat. This would basically be for "Parking", skills that you almost never use/need, but might have to be carried (charm pet for ranger). You can also place something like resurect there. This would let you return a character, but only after the combat was finished.

This would not greatly unbalance the game, since it would have little effect during combat. It would allow Rangers to get use of all 8 slots, without having to carry one just to have a pet. And everybody could have a resurect, without having to sacrifice a combat slot. The only drawback is that if you are in deep kimshe, and you really need to bring back your Monk so they can revive other members of your party.

Loviatar · Aug 26, 2006, 03:16 PM // 15:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mushroom

This would not greatly unbalance the game, since it would have little effect during combat. It would allow Rangers to get use of all 8 slots, without having to carry one just to have a pet. And everybody could have a resurect, without having to sacrifice a combat slot. The only drawback is that if you are in deep kimshe, and you really need to bring back your Monk so they can revive other members of your party.

/unsigned for extreme unbalance issues

Kai Nui · Aug 26, 2006, 03:22 PM // 15:22

I guess it isn't so briliant afterall if you don't have room for a res.

BahamutKaiser · Aug 26, 2006, 06:16 PM // 18:16

The skill limitation is a natural way of making teamwork neccessary, all players arn't ment to do everything. But against certain classes like Ritualist and Elementist, who use a skill that lasts for a few seconds and can't be used again for a minute, those skill slots sufficating, and for classes like Assassin who need a minimum of 3 skill slots just to make a reasonable combo, it is difficult to afford other skills.

A Good Assassin combo takes at least 3 skills, often 4, along with the supporting skills for his manuevers and survival, it is easy to run out of slots, and with such a defenseless class, hard to justify a rez sig, if they are a /mo or /rit, a reusable rez is alright, but a one time rez on a stressed skill build, is hard.

I always hoped that swimming and climbing mechanics would be added to the game, and that two skill slot exclusive to swimming and climbing be added that way exsisting class builds can still be used along with new exploration based features.

If they just add more skill slots than all classes will improve in functionality, with appox the same balance, I don't think it is a bad thing, but what we have is alright. If they added more skill slots, I can't see them adding any more than two.

There are alot of skills which have very low frequency, making the cost of a skill slot very unfavorable, for a powerful skill the character can only use one minute, means he is down one less function for the majority of the time, and often the short term function doesn't provide enough punch to match the usefulness of most frequent skills. With this limitation in skill slots comes the need to have skills which are balanced in output and frequency, if the frequency is so high that even a strong output doesn't match a simple reusable skill, than it isn't balanced, and I think that is the largest balance flaw in A.nets skill selection. With such massive recast times it is almost neccessary to have additional skill slots in order to remain active during combat.

As for the sterio typical 3 hit combo Assassin, that only inclucdes a hand full of skills. The most popular builds are two interchangable 2 hit combos, which often require particular triggers, adding at least one more neccessary skill to the mix, on top of that, there is the lack of frequent knockdown skills which makes one of Assassins favorite skills difficult to meet, often requiring 2 trigger skills along with the other 3 combo skills (as well as Falling Spider). With a useful Assassin build you will be lucky to have 3 slots for defensive and raise skills, and that often excludes mobility skills, the one good mobility skill is an elite, any other "in and out" function will cost you 2 skills, and to make that even more difficult, many of those skills are infrequent themselves. Beyond that, mega combos that include Mobius Strike can easily take 5 slots, reducing available slots for mobility, hexing, survival and rez to 3 slots, and most of those functions can easily take 2 slots. All slots are not equal, for a class that requires a chain of skills to even execute, it is very difficult to manage skill slots, not all attacks have a 10 second recast, and not all spells can be recast every 20 seconds either, so don't bring up a mindless cliche build when you don't know what your talking about, just because Assassin attacks involve lead, off-hand, and dual attacks doesn't mean they default to 3 skill slots to make a useful build.

Just because something would work differently doesn't mean it couldn't be balanced, assuming current balance is the only balance is ignorant, and pretending like the balance we have is uncontested is also ignorant. The balance we have isn't perfect, not by a long shot, the only real balance we have is that A.net shoots down any overpowered and broken builds so no one combination is unbeatable or unfair, it certainly doesn't make all skill combinations equal, nor does it mean that each skill has the same value as any other skill in its best combinations, there are plenty of imbalances. Adding a 9th skill slot is a new threshold, it means new options, it would probably require that some skills be altered, but it doesn't mean that the game suddenly goes broke. The game could work on 6 skill slots, it could work on 10, all that really matters is that it functions well and that players enjoy it, and the game most certainly woln't be less enjoyable if you have more skills to use.

Kool Pajamas · Aug 26, 2006, 07:59 PM // 19:59

I wouldnt mind one more but thats it.

Scavenger Rage · Aug 26, 2006, 10:20 PM // 22:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by BahamutKaiser

The skill limitation is a natural way of making teamwork neccessary, all players arn't ment to do everything. But against certain classes like Ritualist and ..., all that really matters is that it functions well and that players enjoy it, and the game most certainly woln't be less enjoyable if you have more skills to use.

First I find you talking about ignorance laughable, ignorant is actually using huge texts to explain 5 lines of content but whatever, this is just a single minded rant about having to read that whole thing and achieving the same conclusion I had before, no need to take this in consideration.

Second, it took Anet years of hard working to achieve some kind of balanced game using 8 slots and 20 lvl cap, YOU said that even after all that the game still have some unbalances (and I agree in some level), and even after stating you have knowledge of that you still think that a change directly to the core of the gameplay wouldn’t break the game OR IN BEST CASES result in another years of hardworking looking trough skills, weapons and builds to make sure you don’t create something utterly unbalanced is viable?! Sorry to repeat myself, but that is also blind ignorance, its not like you are requesting a new minipet class or anything, you are changing the game core.

Third, this is getting to big, the subject of 8 skills have been discussed by the game designers (people with MUCH better understanding of the game mechanics then us) probably over 10 000 times and its a dead subject.

Latter.

The truth itself · Aug 27, 2006, 12:56 PM // 12:56

Actually, making a special PvP area, where you could only use say, 4 skills, would be very intresting.